Morning Discussion
Morning Shackers. So Duke Nukem 3D is making it's way to XBLA, fortunately we're lucky enough to have the Shack Staff already previewing this fine port for you. Speaking of downloadables, we've got more info on Grand Theft Auto 4's Xbox 360 material and it's looks like it should be pretty hefty. And the Tetris Company rolls out some IP claims with disturbing implications, I for one plan to legally claim any game where keys are matched to doors of a similar color. Bring it id!
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Clay
replyWARHAMMER Players:
If you haven't done so, vote now to help determine where the shack guild plays!
http://gcrobots.com/warpoll/-
I really wish Mythic would just abolish all references to Open RvR. People aren't getting what it actually is and how it will 'break' the game. They should just launch with Core and be done with it.
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NEW Q&A as well http://warhammeralliance.com/ Scroll down a bit to "You ask the questions - Q&A with Mythic". It has some good info on graphics scaling, auction houses, and some stuff before launch.
Also a nice wallpaper of an in game model http://www.warhammeralliance.com/forums/showthread.php?t=41923 . That is confirmed in-game by a mythic employee in the same thread.
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Direct Link: http://www.warhammeralliance.com/forums/showthread.php?t=63643
Interesting quote:
Q: What is the clear definition of open RvR server ruleset?
Josh Drescher: We're still working that out with some of the internal elder testers and some of our EA testers, primarily that's going to mean a lot more open field RvR. One of the things we're looking at right now, is do we keep the chicken mechanic in, if so, where, how do we implement it. We want to do it in a way that is sensible, but we don't want to turn it into chaos where it it's nonsense the entire time. We don't want to waste resources it will take to put up servers like that, and then have it turn out as something nobody actually likes playing on.
The easiest answer is you flag everyone for RvR all the time and leave the chicken in, but we don't know what actually feels right for what that type of server is going to be. We'll probably end up trying three or four different versions and see what the community thinks.
This concerns me.-
They need to stop worrying about it and just not do it at all.
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It's a good thing when they actually have the stuff figured out, Ironing this stuff out 3 weeks before retail launch is cutting it close.
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For example, they might simply make a single adjustment like the Chicken rule (on an Open server) would only apply if you'll actually attack a player in a lower tier (or a player of significantly lower rank) and will not apply if you're just exploring lower tier zones or helping your friend do the PvE quests there. That might satisfy majority of the people who are concerned about teh Chicken system.
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The Chicken activates as soon as you FLAG RvR not when you attack someone. Being constantly flagged in Open sounds like it could break this mechanic. I don't know and I won't be playing Open anyways. Doesn't bother me so I am going to stop arguing about it and being a huge faggot.
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Yeah, they should release the solid normal realms and work on this Open RvR nonsense later. Then they can release it when they like what they have, without ruining new player impressions.
What is this chicken business?-
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i dont know what to say sir...DAoC PvP server was 100% pure awesomeness.
my experiences in open PvP systems yield loads of fun and politics. why politics? because some portion of those gamers feel like they want to control and area and claim it as their own. it did happen in WoW...very very early on. hillsbrad was a war zone...*was* in the early years.-
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I've been trying to resist but I have a feeling I'll be picking this up so I voted.
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I voted but I'm never going to play anyways.
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This is my thought for going order http://www.shacknews.com/laryn.x?id=17763561
Plus I'm sick of playing the dark side. The art design for a lot of the destruction classes bother me, the dark elves in particular.-
From that it sounds like the opposite of what happened in WoW. Alliance is filled with immature deuchebags and Horde is a bit more mature and focused. Stereotypically, that is.
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Obviously the Barrens is the #1 offender for sucky chat, but I've seen it more widespread Alliance. On the 3 servers I've played on, Horde has been better at skill, maturity, and attitude.
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I haven't played Warhammer yet, but in WoW, the good guys have bright and colorful backgrounds for their areas/towns/cities and the bad dudes get this drab, dusty clay boring shit to look at. I can't think of a game where the bad guys had bright cool shit to keep my eyes orgasming the entire time I play.
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If Order wins the vote, stick with Empire. They are crazy in their own special way. I agree on the Greenskins though. The amount of character they put into that race makes the others feel lifeless.
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Once a faction is decided is a class poll going to go up? People should play what they want in the end, but I know that many are kind of sitting on the fence waiting to see what others choose to play.
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Oh geez it's too early in the game to be worried about this! People should just play whatever they want to play and enjoy the launch. There'll be plenty of time for re-rolling and guild drama about tanks and guild drama about healers and guild drama about Clay sleeping with the Witch Elf class lead and giving that shemale all the loot later.
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Because you're sleeping with the Witch Elf class leader, naughty naughty
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In Warhammer, there's Order and Chaos.
"Order" isn't really "good". It's in favor of preserving the status quo, but it is authoritarian and somewhat violent. It does, however, protect humans and the like from a hostile world.
"Chaos" damn well is "evil". They're all about disorder, destruction, violence, murder, consorting with demonic powers, etc.
So there aren't real "good guys", there are very definitely "bad guys".
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yet again, an MMO that has different servers for the different continents.
As much as I'm intrigued by the hype, I don't want to play it unless it's with the shack, and there's never a big enough EU presence for it to be the same...-
So are you going to play on US servers? I'd love to see Fillet make a triumphant return to glory!
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I don't think I get the option of it. I've wanted to come back to the US WoW, but the way I was able to previously no longer exists; and I have 2 level 70s on an EU server now [6/9BT 5/5MH experienced rogue]
And fillet exists again, but he got pissed off with nature and became a warrior :)
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From the official site:
Will Americans and Europeans be on the same servers?
No, our partner GOA is handling all European distribution and all the European servers. They're also handling the translation issues for the German, Italian, Spanish, and French players. We are working much, much more closely with GOA than we did on Camelot. The experience of the typical GOA player, and that of the typical player in North America, should be exactly the same with all content being released simultaneously. -
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I would happily buy you a copy and just email you the key.
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lol what?
Beta is shut down until Sept 7th.-
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CE Closed beta is shut down.
The only beta that is open is the Elder Tester beta and that is on the Test servers.-
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the CE beta was shut down last night so if you got into the Closed Beta via a Collectors Edition code, it is done.
The only beta open currently is the Elder beta on the 'Test' servers. Warpstone/Deathsword using the Test client.
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the developers don't even know wtf the Open ruleset will be like when it launches:
What is the clear definition of open RvR server ruleset?
Josh Drescher: We're still working that out with some of the internal elder testers and some of our EA testers, primarily that's going to mean a lot more open field RvR. One of the things we're looking at right now, is do we keep the chicken mechanic in, if so, where, how do we implement it. We want to do it in a way that is sensible, but we don't want to turn it into chaos where it it's nonsense the entire time. We don't want to waste resources it will take to put up servers like that, and then have it turn out as something nobody actually likes playing on.
The easiest answer is you flag everyone for RvR all the time and leave the chicken in, but we don't know what actually feels right for what that type of server is going to be. We'll probably end up trying three or four different versions and see what the community thinks. -
I'm fairly certain people know how the chicken mechanic works. When you are flagged RvR in a tier that you are out-leveled for you will turn into a chicken. Such as going back to tier 1 at level 12. If you do anything that flags you it will turn you into a chicken.
In Open RvR this is also how it currently works, however even Mythic themselves said that they are uncertain if it will change. I think the main issue is that they don't want high level players playing in the low level RvR "lakes" where the keeps and skirmishes are.
Regardless the main thing is that there isn't much of a point with the Open RvR ruleset. The game already has a very significant RvR presence. Game play is built around that you will want to RvR, such as how scenarios will bring you back to the exact same location that you left from. Why RvR also has to be dragged into the PvE areas is beyond me. Open RvR is mainly going to cater to those that want to go solo and harass the enemy on their own land.
On the core ruleset alone you will have more PvP opportunities than you will know what to do with.-
OK but why WOULDN"T you want to to RvR in the areas that are "safe" on open servers? you say there isn't much of a point with the Open RvR ruleset. And I would say there isn't much of a point with the core RvR ruleset. In this WARHAMMER game your sworn enemy (by Realm) is standing there, you should be hell bent on killing him. What difference does this invisible boundary near lakes and keeps matter?
You would still get credit for killing Order/Dest even if you aren't next to an RvR objective.
And the Chicken seems like a stupid mechanic, but it keeps away griefers, which is what everyone seems to be crying about.-
Because I plan on living in the RvR lakes taking over Keeps while also queuing up for scenarios. It's going to provide so much PvP and game play that I just don't see the point of leaving the area to go to PvE land to kill random people. I'd probably kill even less players for that matter and suffer much more down time if I were to go kill people in PvE areas.
Also RvR in the lakes, taking over keeps and skirmishes will better assist the realm as a whole for the main course....invading the enemy Capital City. This "invisible boundary" mainly keeps the two realms focused on this goal. More points are earned by completing objectives in the RvR lakes than killing Bob the Goblin 10 times who was trying to do a PQ.
I recognize the players that want to grind boars in the PvE area. However I don't have any interest in harassing them. People that mainly hang around the PvE area often do not want to be bothered with PvP to begin with.
[y]Remove keeps sieges, skirmishes, scenarios, city sieges and I will sing a different tune. I'd join you not on an open rvr server, but a straight up FFA server in a heartbeat.[y]
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I am all for pvp servers, i was still play on Malganis and wouldnt have it any other way. however this is not wow. I was all for open RvR till i started reading up on it. and what i see makes me nervous. having a mode that the devs were "pressured" into implementing and the fact that the game launches in a month and they havent even figured out what they are doing with it just leaves me with the impression that they will tack it on then never look back. AoC is a good example for what happens when you dont know what the fuck you are doing and just implement thing hap hazardly. the reason AoC failed is because they expected people to play for poorly thought out beta. WAR seems to have its shit planned out (at least for core RvR).
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15th for CE head start
16th for SE head start
18th for US launch
19th for EU launch
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The way I see it: In Core, players can stand just outside the objective, combat flag off. waiting for backup to arrive, while the other side works and basically waits. Then they all go charging in.
If there is no flag, you can harass and molest players before their numbers are greater than yours keeping the area clean for you to work.-
it does not really work that way since each side of an RvR zone has really hard core npcs guarding it. So enemies would wait there, but you could not take them.
Also of note is that once you are flagged for pvp it takes a little while for it to disappear. So if someone ducks into and rvr zone it takes 15 seconds for it to activate and a while longer for it to deactivate. This means you can chase them down outside of the zone (if you can stay away from npcs).
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A house divided against itself cannot stand.
-Abraham Lincoln
In all seriousness, due to the natural attrition of the first month of MMORPGs, the weaker of the two sides is almost guaranteed to shrivel up and die. It even happened with the Alliance side of WOW, which had a substantial following.-
The alliance-side of WoW was less due to attrition natural to MMOs, and more due to a bad balance between casual and hardcore players causing the guild to split. I don't know how much of an issue that would be for WAR, since higher level players can't run lower level players through PvP content...
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Look every time the Conan PvE guild posted here the PvP guild would thread crap and call everyone pussies, until they finally started to make their own threads and the PvE lot decided that Conan was a shit game. It's already started again now and if there was any sign that the Open would quietly acknowledge that the majority like the idea of Core, will be happy playing Core and stop being so stupidly contemptuous of the Core players then maybe a second shack guild wouldn't be annoying drama. However it doesn't look like it's going to happen so I'm not willing to offer any concessions to a group who generally have shown no understanding of the Core players.
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You offering concessions is meaningless anyway. People will play where they want, Core or Open, Destruction or Order. The Core guild will probably be better off without players that would rather play Open. The Open preference players would most likely just be unhappy on the Core server, thinking the grass is greener on the Core and they would complain in guild chat making others miserable.
As for thread shitty after the game goes live, why not just put up a guild forum and post there? Keep the thread shitters out. -
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There are a bunch of good people in the guild, lots and lots of new people but it's definitely not a shack guild.
The guild changed to hardcore mode, and it has become more about dominating content than bringing in new people and just in general being more casual. Wiping to bosses we've beat before (please see Firemaw) no longer is an option while people learn.
It's just a different guild than it used to be. Doesn't mean it's worse or better than before just different. Unfortunatly that change in MO kind of excluded myself from raiding, raids became more business than fun, so I've taken a backseat as have others but GCR still is alive and kicking.
I just wish we had the people that made up the guild and helped it live for years raiding more, miss raiding with my old friends like Phil etc... Hopefully I will be able to get back into things during WOTLK.-
honestly, It wasn’t so much a guild decision than it was Blizzard's design. We tried to maintain the "casual" raiding scheme that we had. But it simply the game just doesn’t allow for that. We certainly leaned a little too hard with the rostering imo and I do plan on it being different for this expansion. But Blizzard seems finally aware of this kind of problem and is doing their best to eliminate it. Add to that the fact that 10mans will offer their own progression path, I expect a LOT more inclusive raiding.
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Well correct, boss fights are definitely much more creative and interesting. To go along with that creativity more focus is put on individuals to do a function or perform at a level that should be equal to other people in your group. When someone doesn't the entire group suffers. It was the same in 40 mans, but it was much less so (1 out 40, compared to 1 out of 25/10) and not to mention the fights now are much more complicated than they used to be.
Naturally casual raiding has gone to the wayside if you want to progress some. Shoot we saw that in Kara when you and I were leading our way through back in Feburary. It was pretty obvious that static groups were the only way to go even though it pained me to say so, hell I remember all the arguments against doing so with Jahgah etc... Was definitely painful to say the least.
Hopefully WOTLK will be a bit more forgiving with including more people in raiding, and I think 10 man instances will definitely be a good direction, I hope it works.
As for how hard we 'leaned' on the rostering, meh, in Sunwell it kind of had to happen, like I said unfortunatly I was one of the ones left behind, that's just life. People deal with it (hopefully). I was more upset at being booted from being a CL/officer than I ever was at not going into Sunwell. -
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I remember you, you were super nice!
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hahaha you milk bagging sob
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it was never really that good :P
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I'd say a little of both.
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I'm sticking with Order, till my beloved Skaven get released!
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I just hope everyone decides on something and we don't completely split, I am willing to go to any server or side at this point just to play with the most shackers.
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I'm interested in seeing what the results of a similar poll are like after the preview / beta.
Everyone in it should try both Order and Destruction and also Core / Open (if possible).
People who are picked Order and only Order or Destruction and only Destruction before they've even played the game scare me.-
Yea another thing is people dismissing the tome tactics so easily and saying the tome is absolutely worthless. I really don't want to end up with a severely gimped character because I didn't know I had to do some tier 1 or 2 epic quest line with the hidden lairs.
I hope the devs clear up those issues, a lot of elder players are voicing their concerns over this issue for the open servers.
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